Re: (TV) 'Don't Die' + Hell quotes on writing credits

[Bob Beatty <bobjb2002@yahoo.ca>]

Deb:
Oh, it was just the Tom interview you referred to before, huh, not the Hell
one? I didn't actually re-find that Tom article today where he accuses Hell of
stealing his music, but was just paraphrasing from memory (hopefully, I got
the gist fairly close to correct!)

As we know, lot of officially unreleased Tom-related recordings have found
their way onto bootlegs.  But Tom's managed to successfully keep a lid on his
Neon Boys songs, somehow. Like you, I'd sure like to hear them. The music on
the Hell sung ones is good, & presumably the Tom ones are at least equally as
good. Even if Tom's not completely happy with the quality of the recordings,
you'd think he might be willing to release them for "historical" & fan
interest at least.


--- On Mon, 7/16/12, postitnote <postitnote@sbcglobal.net> wrote:

From: postitnote <postitnote@sbcglobal.net>
Subject: Re: (TV) 'Don't Die' + Hell quotes on writing credits
To: tv@obbard.com
Received: Monday, July 16, 2012, 12:03 PM

Thanks Bob for coming up w/ all of that info and finding that Tom early Tom
interview (it was gonna take me some time).  Actually I don't believe I've
read that Hell interview that you referred to here before.  So thanks for
adding that also.  But I do remember he saying before that all he knew
musically he learned from Tom.

It's really a shame that Tom doesn't care to release his early Neon Boys
songs.  Prob he thinks why release such old stuff, when it would mean a lot to
fans of his.  I love the Neon Boys stuff, where people say Television wasn't
really 'punk', the Neon Boys were def more punkish.

BTW, is there any word as to when Hell's autobiography is supposed to be
coming out?



--- On Mon, 7/16/12, Bob Beatty <bobjb2002@yahoo.ca> wrote:

> From: Bob Beatty <bobjb2002@yahoo.ca>
> Subject: Re: (TV) 'Don't Die' + Hell quotes on writing credits
> To: tv@obbard.com
> Date: Monday, July 16, 2012, 8:34 AM
> Hey Deb:
> On checking my oldB  "Shake" labelB  vinyl
> single/e.p. with The Neon Boys'B
> "That's all I Know (Right Now)" & "Love Comes in
> Spurts", Phil's right in his
> recall of those songs being credited to "Verlaine-Hell".
> Those two Neon Boys
> songs comprise one side. The other side isn't The Neon Boys,
> but is Richard
> Hell & the Voidoids, with two songs, "Don't Die"
> (Hell-Julian), & "Time"
> (Hell).
>
> I bet some confusion may have stemmed from the e.p. having
> The Neon Boys on
> one side, & Richard Hell & the Voidoids on the
> other, which might have led to
> the error in the listing you saw crediting "Don't Die" to
> The Neon Boys.
>
> I found that Hell interview referred to by Deb I think where
> Hell where he
> talks about how songs were co-written by he & Tom in The
> Neon Boys.
> http://www.trakmarx.com/2003_05/050_hell.htm
> HELL QUOTE: "...There were three [Neon Boys] songs that I
> sang and three songs
> that Tom sang. Tom
> wrote the instrumental music to all of it and I wrote the
> words and the
> singing to the songs I sang. I was just starting to learn
> music. I
> played the bass on the songs but it was all rudimentary
> patterns.
> Basically Tom showed me what to play. We didnbt want all
> that time to be
> completely wasted so we recorded the six songs and my three
> songs are
> whatbs come out under the name Neon Boys. Tom wouldnbt allow
> the songs
> he
> sang to come out and he has never released them. I donbt
> know what
> his
> feelings are now, but he clearly hasnbt wanted to put out
> the ones
> that he
> wrote. He agreed to do that little Shake single which
> eventually
>  got
> re-released. The first version on Shake just had two songs,
> bThatbs
>  All I
> Knowb and the early version of bLove Comes In Spurtsb, which
> has
> nothing in common with the Voidoidsb version, except the
> title.
> Different
> music, different words. And then when I released it with
> Overground [records]
> I added the third song, bHigh Heeled Wheelsb. And
> that was the whole
> history of the Neon Boys."
>
> - I first read the above Hell interview years ago, but
> realized just today my
> recall was faulty re. what Hell said re. co-writing with
> Tom, 'cause my foggy
> memory was of Hell saying
> Television songs he sang were all co-written with Tom, with
> Tom writing all
> the instrumental music. It may be a possibility Hell's
> Television songs were
> all co-written with Tom the same way as the Neon Boys ones
> were, but that's
> not what Hell says here, as he only talks about co-writing
> Neon Boys songs.
> For a long while, based on my errant memory of the above
> Hell quote, I assumed
> since "Blank Generation" was a song Hell sang in Television,
> that Tom likely
> wrote the song's music but was not credited as co-writer on
> the Voidoids
> album.
>
> There's a late '70s Tom interview I think Deb refers to
> (part of that articles
> collection I earlier posted a link to in this forum:
> http://www.4shared.com/zip/yNdZURDR/tom_verlaine_television_etc_ar.html
> )
> where Tom does accuse Hell of essentially stealing his music
> & using it on the
> Blank Generation album. As I recall, Tom said when he
> listened to that first
> Voidoids album he heard a bunch of Neon Boys music on it
> he'd come up with,
> although I don't think he mentioned Hell "thefts" of
> Television material
> specifically, just Neon Boys music.
>
>
> --- On Sun, 7/15/12, postitnote <postitnote@sbcglobal.net>
> wrote:
>
> From: postitnote <postitnote@sbcglobal.net>
> Subject: Re: (TV) 'Don't Die' question?
> To: tv@obbard.com
> Received: Sunday, July 15, 2012, 8:17 PM
>
> Yeah, I'd appreciate you checking the credits.B  But I
> agree about there prob
> being a lot of 'looseness' back then.B  And if Tom
> wasn't worried about it...
> B
> Would you know who is credited w/ writing most of the
> Voidoids songs?B B B
>
> If I run across that interview I talked about I'll post it
> here.
>
> Thanks!
>
>
>
> --- On Sun, 7/15/12, Phil Obbard <pobbard@yahoo.com>
> wrote:
>
> > From: Phil Obbard <pobbard@yahoo.com>
> > Subject: Re: (TV) 'Don't Die' question?
> > To: "tv@obbard.com"
> <tv@obbard.com>
> > Date: Sunday, July 15, 2012, 2:19 PM
> > I'll have to check the credits when I
> > am home, but I believe the 3 release
> > Neon Boys tracks (all sung by Hell) are credited lyrics
> to
> > Hell, music to
> > Hell/Verlaine, but I could be wrong.
> >
> > There is a lot of looseness in credits
> > back then; if Verlaine really did co-write the music
> for
> > "High Heeled Wheels",
> > then he deserved a credit for "You Gotta Lose" that I
> am
> > sure he does not get.
> > And who can forget how many tracks the Heartbreakers
> > "borrowed" from Hell once
> > he left, or added their names to the credits? "Chinese
> > Rocks" had his name
> > stripped from the credits, "Love Comes in Spurts" was
> given
> > new lyrics to
> > become "One Track Mind", etc...
> >
> > --Phil
> >
> >
> >
> > ________________________________
> > From: postitnote <postitnote@sbcglobal.net>
> > To: tv@obbard.com
> > Sent: Sunday,
> > July 15, 2012 2:11 AM
> > Subject: Re: (TV) 'Don't Die' question?
> >B
> > Okay, thanks.
> > I've got that cleared up now.
> >
> > On, the Neon Boys though, even though some
> > songs are Richard Hell songs.B  wasn't all of the
> music
> > written by Tom though?
> > I mean, Richard sings some of the songs where the
> 'lyrics'
> > are his.B
> >
> > I also
> > remember an interview w/ Tom and I believe it was
> British
> > (an early one) and
> > he was asked about Hell's music outside of
> Television/Neon
> > Boys.B  Tom said
> > sthg like Hell borrowed some of his music, as he could
> hear
> > it in some of the
> > songs.B  Tom said that he didn't really mind
> > though.B  I'm sorry that I don't
> > remember which interview that was as I read that awhile
> back
> > and my memory
> > sucks.
> >
> > I'm not putting down Richard as he's def a talented
> guy.
> >
> > Is this
> > valid or am I off-base?
> >
> > --- On Sat, 7/14/12, Phil Obbard <pobbard@yahoo.com>
> > wrote:
> >
> > > From: Phil Obbard <pobbard@yahoo.com>
> > > Subject: Re: (TV) 'Don't
> > Die' question?
> > > To: "tv@obbard.com"
> > <tv@obbard.com>
> > > Date: Saturday, July
> > 14, 2012, 5:36 PM
> > > It's a Voidoids demo v. 1979. It
> > > appears, along with a
> > similar demo of "Time",
> > > on the same release from Shake (and later
> > Overground) that
> > > gave us the only
> > > Neon Boys material we've heard to date.
> > >
> > > So "Time" and "Don't Die" have
> > > nothing do to with Television, other
> > than being Richard Hell
> > > solo material.
> > > More info on Keith's
> > > site:
> > http://www.thewonder.co.uk/facts/bandrels.htm#Singles
> > >
> > >
> > > --Phil
> > >
> > ________________________________
> > >B  From: postitnote
> > <postitnote@sbcglobal.net>
> > > To: tv@obbard.com
> > > Sent: Saturday, July 14,
> > 2012 8:17 PM
> > > Subject: Re: (TV)
> > > 'Don't Die' question?
> > >B
> > > I wonder if
> > anyone could clear this up for me?B  There
> > > is the song attributed to the Neon
> > Boys called 'Don't Die'
> > > (great song).B
> > >
> > > I
> > > have this song listed as a
> > Neon Boys song but I noticed in
> > > some comments that
> > > people are saying that
> > this recording is actually a demo
> > > played by Richard
> > > Hell and the Voidoids
> > for Sire Records.B  I still will
> > > presume that it was
> > > actually written by
> > Tom and the lyrics were done by Hell
> > > (they made a great
> > > team).B  But so the
> > recording is actually Richard and
> > > the Voidoids playing it,
> > > instead of the
> > Neon Boys?B  Is that true?
> > > --------------
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