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Re: (TV) 'Don't Die' + Hell quotes on writing credits/What I Heard?



Bob, you've found a lot of good info.  Thanks! Would you happen to have any info on the song 'What I Heard'.  I have that it's an early Television song w/ Hell still in the band?  Is that correct?  And it sounds like a Tom style song but the singing is done by Richard Lloyd, right? I can't make out any of the lyrics but wondered who wrote them...? 

Deb 


--- On Mon, 7/16/12, Bob Beatty <bobjb2002@yahoo.ca> wrote:

> From: Bob Beatty <bobjb2002@yahoo.ca>
> Subject: Re: (TV) 'Don't Die' + Hell quotes on writing credits
> To: tv@obbard.com
> Date: Monday, July 16, 2012, 10:09 AM
> Deb:
> Oh, it was just the Tom interview you referred to before,
> huh, not the Hell
> one? I didn't actually re-find that Tom article today where
> he accuses Hell of
> stealing his music, but was just paraphrasing from memory
> (hopefully, I got
> the gist fairly close to correct!)
> 
> As we know, lot of officially unreleased Tom-related
> recordings have found
> their way onto bootlegs.  But Tom's managed to
> successfully keep a lid on his
> Neon Boys songs, somehow. Like you, I'd sure like to hear
> them. The music on
> the Hell sung ones is good, & presumably the Tom ones
> are at least equally as
> good. Even if Tom's not completely happy with the quality of
> the recordings,
> you'd think he might be willing to release them for
> "historical" & fan
> interest at least.
> 
> 
> --- On Mon, 7/16/12, postitnote <postitnote@sbcglobal.net>
> wrote:
> 
> From: postitnote <postitnote@sbcglobal.net>
> Subject: Re: (TV) 'Don't Die' + Hell quotes on writing
> credits
> To: tv@obbard.com
> Received: Monday, July 16, 2012, 12:03 PM
> 
> Thanks Bob for coming up w/ all of that info and finding
> that Tom early Tom
> interview (it was gonna take me some time).  Actually I
> don't believe I've
> read that Hell interview that you referred to here
> before.  So thanks for
> adding that also.  But I do remember he saying before
> that all he knew
> musically he learned from Tom.
> 
> It's really a shame that Tom doesn't care to release his
> early Neon Boys
> songs.  Prob he thinks why release such old stuff, when
> it would mean a lot to
> fans of his.  I love the Neon Boys stuff, where people
> say Television wasn't
> really 'punk', the Neon Boys were def more punkish.
> 
> BTW, is there any word as to when Hell's autobiography is
> supposed to be
> coming out?
> 
> 
> 
> --- On Mon, 7/16/12, Bob Beatty <bobjb2002@yahoo.ca>
> wrote:
> 
> > From: Bob Beatty <bobjb2002@yahoo.ca>
> > Subject: Re: (TV) 'Don't Die' + Hell quotes on writing
> credits
> > To: tv@obbard.com
> > Date: Monday, July 16, 2012, 8:34 AM
> > Hey Deb:
> > On checking my oldB  "Shake" labelB  vinyl
> > single/e.p. with The Neon Boys'B
> > "That's all I Know (Right Now)" & "Love Comes in
> > Spurts", Phil's right in his
> > recall of those songs being credited to
> "Verlaine-Hell".
> > Those two Neon Boys
> > songs comprise one side. The other side isn't The Neon
> Boys,
> > but is Richard
> > Hell & the Voidoids, with two songs, "Don't Die"
> > (Hell-Julian), & "Time"
> > (Hell).
> >
> > I bet some confusion may have stemmed from the e.p.
> having
> > The Neon Boys on
> > one side, & Richard Hell & the Voidoids on the
> > other, which might have led to
> > the error in the listing you saw crediting "Don't Die"
> to
> > The Neon Boys.
> >
> > I found that Hell interview referred to by Deb I think
> where
> > Hell where he
> > talks about how songs were co-written by he & Tom
> in The
> > Neon Boys.
> > http://www.trakmarx.com/2003_05/050_hell.htm
> > HELL QUOTE: "...There were three [Neon Boys] songs that
> I
> > sang and three songs
> > that Tom sang. Tom
> > wrote the instrumental music to all of it and I wrote
> the
> > words and the
> > singing to the songs I sang. I was just starting to
> learn
> > music. I
> > played the bass on the songs but it was all
> rudimentary
> > patterns.
> > Basically Tom showed me what to play. We didnbt want
> all
> > that time to be
> > completely wasted so we recorded the six songs and my
> three
> > songs are
> > whatbs come out under the name Neon Boys. Tom wouldnbt
> allow
> > the songs
> > he
> > sang to come out and he has never released them. I
> donbt
> > know what
> > his
> > feelings are now, but he clearly hasnbt wanted to put
> out
> > the ones
> > that he
> > wrote. He agreed to do that little Shake single which
> > eventually
> >  got
> > re-released. The first version on Shake just had two
> songs,
> > bThatbs
> >  All I
> > Knowb and the early version of bLove Comes In Spurtsb,
> which
> > has
> > nothing in common with the Voidoidsb version, except
> the
> > title.
> > Different
> > music, different words. And then when I released it
> with
> > Overground [records]
> > I added the third song, bHigh Heeled Wheelsb. And
> > that was the whole
> > history of the Neon Boys."
> >
> > - I first read the above Hell interview years ago, but
> > realized just today my
> > recall was faulty re. what Hell said re. co-writing
> with
> > Tom, 'cause my foggy
> > memory was of Hell saying
> > Television songs he sang were all co-written with Tom,
> with
> > Tom writing all
> > the instrumental music. It may be a possibility Hell's
> > Television songs were
> > all co-written with Tom the same way as the Neon Boys
> ones
> > were, but that's
> > not what Hell says here, as he only talks about
> co-writing
> > Neon Boys songs.
> > For a long while, based on my errant memory of the
> above
> > Hell quote, I assumed
> > since "Blank Generation" was a song Hell sang in
> Television,
> > that Tom likely
> > wrote the song's music but was not credited as
> co-writer on
> > the Voidoids
> > album.
> >
> > There's a late '70s Tom interview I think Deb refers
> to
> > (part of that articles
> > collection I earlier posted a link to in this forum:
> > http://www.4shared.com/zip/yNdZURDR/tom_verlaine_television_etc_ar.html
> > )
> > where Tom does accuse Hell of essentially stealing his
> music
> > & using it on the
> > Blank Generation album. As I recall, Tom said when he
> > listened to that first
> > Voidoids album he heard a bunch of Neon Boys music on
> it
> > he'd come up with,
> > although I don't think he mentioned Hell "thefts" of
> > Television material
> > specifically, just Neon Boys music.
> >
> >
> > --- On Sun, 7/15/12, postitnote <postitnote@sbcglobal.net>
> > wrote:
> >
> > From: postitnote <postitnote@sbcglobal.net>
> > Subject: Re: (TV) 'Don't Die' question?
> > To: tv@obbard.com
> > Received: Sunday, July 15, 2012, 8:17 PM
> >
> > Yeah, I'd appreciate you checking the credits.B 
> But I
> > agree about there prob
> > being a lot of 'looseness' back then.B  And if
> Tom
> > wasn't worried about it...
> > B
> > Would you know who is credited w/ writing most of the
> > Voidoids songs?B B B
> >
> > If I run across that interview I talked about I'll post
> it
> > here.
> >
> > Thanks!
> >
> >
> >
> > --- On Sun, 7/15/12, Phil Obbard <pobbard@yahoo.com>
> > wrote:
> >
> > > From: Phil Obbard <pobbard@yahoo.com>
> > > Subject: Re: (TV) 'Don't Die' question?
> > > To: "tv@obbard.com"
> > <tv@obbard.com>
> > > Date: Sunday, July 15, 2012, 2:19 PM
> > > I'll have to check the credits when I
> > > am home, but I believe the 3 release
> > > Neon Boys tracks (all sung by Hell) are credited
> lyrics
> > to
> > > Hell, music to
> > > Hell/Verlaine, but I could be wrong.
> > >
> > > There is a lot of looseness in credits
> > > back then; if Verlaine really did co-write the
> music
> > for
> > > "High Heeled Wheels",
> > > then he deserved a credit for "You Gotta Lose"
> that I
> > am
> > > sure he does not get.
> > > And who can forget how many tracks the
> Heartbreakers
> > > "borrowed" from Hell once
> > > he left, or added their names to the credits?
> "Chinese
> > > Rocks" had his name
> > > stripped from the credits, "Love Comes in Spurts"
> was
> > given
> > > new lyrics to
> > > become "One Track Mind", etc...
> > >
> > > --Phil
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ________________________________
> > > From: postitnote <postitnote@sbcglobal.net>
> > > To: tv@obbard.com
> > > Sent: Sunday,
> > > July 15, 2012 2:11 AM
> > > Subject: Re: (TV) 'Don't Die' question?
> > >B
> > > Okay, thanks.
> > > I've got that cleared up now.
> > >
> > > On, the Neon Boys though, even though some
> > > songs are Richard Hell songs.B  wasn't all of
> the
> > music
> > > written by Tom though?
> > > I mean, Richard sings some of the songs where the
> > 'lyrics'
> > > are his.B
> > >
> > > I also
> > > remember an interview w/ Tom and I believe it was
> > British
> > > (an early one) and
> > > he was asked about Hell's music outside of
> > Television/Neon
> > > Boys.B  Tom said
> > > sthg like Hell borrowed some of his music, as he
> could
> > hear
> > > it in some of the
> > > songs.B  Tom said that he didn't really mind
> > > though.B  I'm sorry that I don't
> > > remember which interview that was as I read that
> awhile
> > back
> > > and my memory
> > > sucks.
> > >
> > > I'm not putting down Richard as he's def a
> talented
> > guy.
> > >
> > > Is this
> > > valid or am I off-base?
> > >
> > > --- On Sat, 7/14/12, Phil Obbard <pobbard@yahoo.com>
> > > wrote:
> > >
> > > > From: Phil Obbard <pobbard@yahoo.com>
> > > > Subject: Re: (TV) 'Don't
> > > Die' question?
> > > > To: "tv@obbard.com"
> > > <tv@obbard.com>
> > > > Date: Saturday, July
> > > 14, 2012, 5:36 PM
> > > > It's a Voidoids demo v. 1979. It
> > > > appears, along with a
> > > similar demo of "Time",
> > > > on the same release from Shake (and later
> > > Overground) that
> > > > gave us the only
> > > > Neon Boys material we've heard to date.
> > > >
> > > > So "Time" and "Don't Die" have
> > > > nothing do to with Television, other
> > > than being Richard Hell
> > > > solo material.
> > > > More info on Keith's
> > > > site:
> > > http://www.thewonder.co.uk/facts/bandrels.htm#Singles
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > --Phil
> > > >
> > > ________________________________
> > > >B  From: postitnote
> > > <postitnote@sbcglobal.net>
> > > > To: tv@obbard.com
> > > > Sent: Saturday, July 14,
> > > 2012 8:17 PM
> > > > Subject: Re: (TV)
> > > > 'Don't Die' question?
> > > >B
> > > > I wonder if
> > > anyone could clear this up for me?B  There
> > > > is the song attributed to the Neon
> > > Boys called 'Don't Die'
> > > > (great song).B
> > > >
> > > > I
> > > > have this song listed as a
> > > Neon Boys song but I noticed in
> > > > some comments that
> > > > people are saying that
> > > this recording is actually a demo
> > > > played by Richard
> > > > Hell and the Voidoids
> > > for Sire Records.B  I still will
> > > > presume that it was
> > > > actually written by
> > > Tom and the lyrics were done by Hell
> > > > (they made a great
> > > > team).B  But so the
> > > recording is actually Richard and
> > > > the Voidoids playing it,
> > > > instead of the
> > > Neon Boys?B  Is that true?
> > > > --------------
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