[Date Prev][Date Next][Thread Prev][Thread Next][Date Index][Thread Index]

RE: Arrow Rerun #s / Brighton Parties / T.V.'s Complaint / Arrow Head Too slow / RE: (TV) The man who recorded the original "Arrow" boot says:

Dan McGuire is the guy who told me he taped the MFP show.

Scott Simpson
212 795 2846

-----Original Message-----
From: tv-owner@obbard.com [mailto:tv-owner@obbard.com] On Behalf Of Leo
Sent: Monday, February 24, 2014 7:27 PM
To: tv@obbard.com
Subject: Arrow Rerun #s / Brighton Parties / T.V.'s Complaint / Arrow Head
Too slow / RE: (TV) The man who recorded the original "Arrow" boot says:

I bought my first copy of the vinyl Arrow bootleg at Bleecker Bob's record
store in the Village around 1980. Each LP had a blank white cardboard
cover/sleeve and each sleeve was stamped with its pressing # (mine reads:
ARROW RERUN F.85 #1,001). It had incredible sound quality for a bootleg (and
I'm a hard grader).

I practically wore it out (have since gotten a newer copy on e-bay).  So, I
was very happy in 1982 when ROIR released the cassette version that
contained twice as many songs of the legendary performance of March 20,
1978, My Father's Place, Roslyn Long Is. But I was terribly disappointed by
the sound-quality of that ROIR cassette.  Nevertheless, I went thru/wore out
3 copies over the next 10 years.  :>) I also own the 2001 double vinyl
version and the 1999 remastered cd version (and Rovner's The Big One's
'Arrow Head').

At one point, a couple of days before one of my infamous dance-parties in
Brighton/Boston in 1982(which always featured lots of Television, Verlaine
solo albums, and Roxy Music), I attempted to create a Reel-to-Reel Teac
recording for the party, which "grafted" Lloyd's incredible, extended solo,
on the ROIR cassette version of 'Ain't That Nothin'', onto the studio LP
version by using my using my cassette deck and turntable.

RE: There's an old Tom interview somewhere where he says the ROIR CD of "The
Blow Up" that came out later after the cassette was "completely illegal."

I find this all somewhat strange and confusing since the **1999 remastered
cd** and 2001 remastered vinyl of "The Blow Up" both have on them: "All
tracks selected by Tom Verlaine" and both are ROIR official releases.

Maybe the answer is that *1992 cd* (and 1992 double LP) of The Blow Up are
from a company/entity called Danceteria, DANLP030, France (and DANLP030,
France, 1992).  Although, they have written on them: "Licensed from ROIR",
maybe Danceteria's cd (and LP) were illegal], and it's Danceteria's cd (&
LP) about which T.V. was complaining. 

The Arrow Head bootleg version of the March 20, 1978 show has an incorrect
speed, (it's too slow, needs its speed increased by 1.6%). This can be
determined easily by comparing the song-length of 'Marquee Moon' on the
remastered 1999 commercial (official) release cd with 'M M''s song-length on
the Arrow Head boot. 

On the 1999 remastered cd, 'M M', just the song itself (i.e., not counting
its track's silent lead-in) is 14:43.5 versus 14:57.6 on the Arrowhead
bootleg version. (With both endings occurring with Ficca very short
drum-roll followed immediately by a final click of the drum-sticks.) 


-----Original Message-----
From: tv-owner@obbard.com [mailto:tv-owner@obbard.com] On Behalf Of Bob
Sent: Monday, February 24, 2014 2:09 PM
To: tv@obbard.com
Subject: Re: (TV) The man who recorded the original "Arrow" boot says:

I think that Arrow boot taper
likely sold me a cassette of that sh
ow back In '78 or '79 along with a
few other Television shows I mail-ord
ered.  As Dennis says, he was a mail-order tape seller. I recall at that
time Trouser Press music mag was not a bad source for finding mail order ta
pe traders/sellers as the mag printed their ads. One of the Television c
assettes I got via a seller's Trouser Press ad was a 1978 show at My Fat
her's Place, Roslyn, NY. My memory is the guy said in his catalogue/list
that it was his own recording. I can't say I have a clear memory of his
name 35 years on, or if it might have been "Acker", "Crackers", or "Dan .."
Of Television shows/recordings I got via mail order in the '70s on boots
cassettes, 10 or 12 maybe, that "My Father's Place" one was my fave. Great
performance, plus the audio quality was better than most.

When "Th
e Blow Up" came out on cassette, I noticed it was the same show as I knew a
s the My Father's Place gig. I was disappointed it omitted "Poor Circula
tion" though (which the taper explains about on the piece he wrote that
Keith kindly posted) which was on the tape I already had. 
Plus the audio
 quality was poorer on the official release. I never owned the "Arrow" viny
l version that's supposed to sound better than the cassette (no surprise
there), or the CD of "The Blow Up". 

There's an old Tom interview
somewhere where he says the ROIR CD of "The Blow Up" that came out later
after the cassette was "completely illegal." I'm guessing the casset te was
maybe authorized but not the CD (-?). Nice of the Arrow L.P. bootleg ger to
actually see to it that Tom received some royalties from it.

reed, it would be nice if Mr. Acker, or who ever the taper is, would make a
n audio file from his master tape to share.

Robert Christgau & J
ohn Piccarella wrote the liner notes for "The Blow Up" cassette which I'm l
ooking at now.
I've often found  Christgau's writing style & attitude i rritating & hard to
appreciate, but enjoyed these notes, which have thei r moments. But who
knows, maybe the best observations in them are Piccarell a's, not

I've scanned the front & back of the cassette in sert for The Blow Up In
case anyone who doesn't have them wants to read the m, here:
Or tinyurl versions of the same lin
ks, as MM/TV list emails sometimes fail to have long URLs fully highlighted


On Monday, February 24, 2014 7:05:20 AM, Steve Rovner <serovner@mi
ndspring.com> wrote:


Does he still have cassettes?
Or a first generation copy?  Would be nice to get copies!

nal Message-----
>From: Dennis D <dend@nyc.rr.com>
>Sent: Feb 23, 2014
9:33 PM
>To: tv@obbard.com
>Subject: Re: (TV) The man who recorded the
original "Arrow" boot says:
>There was a taper back in the day that d
id a lot of mail order stuff under 
>the name of Charles R Ackers a/k/a C
>I always though he recorded that show. I had a copy of it well
before it was 
>released as a bootleg. I can't remember Crackers real nam
e though,
>I haven't seen him since like 1980.
>Subject: RE: (TV) T
he man who recorded the original "Arrow" boot says:
>Was his name Dan
..  I believe I know who he is.
>But thanks, I had no idea the Arrow
 boot was the Roslyn show.
>Scott Simpson
>212 795 2846
-----Original Message-----
>From: tv-owner@obbard.com [mailto:tv-owner@ob
bard.com] On Behalf Of Keith
>Sent: Sunday, February 23, 2014
4:21 PM
>To: tv@obbard.com
>Subject: (TV) The man who recorded the orig
inal "Arrow" boot says:
>I moved to New York in the spring of 197
7, following a weekend jaunt which
>included a trip to CBGB for a first t
aste of live Television.
>Returning to Ohio, I spent a trial night in an
apartment at The Plaza in
>Cleveland recently vacated by an aspiring Cont
ortion. As I surveyed the
>frozen parking lot next morning to make sure m
y Studebaker was still there,
>I decided that if I was going to move some
place scary and bleak, I might as
>well think big. But by the time I got
back to Manhattan, Richard Lloyd was
>in rehab in preparation for Televis
ion's European debut, so almost a year
>passed before I got the chance fo
r a recharge.
>When show day finally came I hid my Nakamichi 550 in the b
ottom of a
>crumpled bag of thrift store shirts and set out for Long Isla
nd, where the
>expected fireworks ensued. A couple of years later a frien
d with a mail
>order record business (another big Television fan) suggest
ed a bootleg of
>the big night. Most of them went to an exporter he worke
d with, but I would
>visit Bleecker Bob in the West Village a couple of t
imes a week to sell to
>this notorious cheapskate, a pitiful few copies a
t a time. Although it was a
>steady seller in his shop, he refused to tie
 up his working capital. He
>always complained about the cover, too.
t some point, Neil Cooper of ROIR decided to make a play for the cassette

>masters, advising my partner in crime that he intended to reissue with
>without our cooperation. We eventually gave in, surprising Verlaine w
ith a
>modest royalty payment the next time he came around to unload disp
>from his record collection - like the L'Intrepide Bavon Marie M
arie LP I
>took home. Whenever our little project is mentioned, there's a
lways a
>disclaimer that the original vinyl boot sounds better than the B
low Up
>reissue. Well, we tried. Disc mastering was done at an upper crus
t Hollywood
>establishment when Lindsey Buckingham had finally run out of
 coke and gone
>home for the day, the metal stampers came from Europadisk
, the first
>high-end facility of its kind in the US. I also rejected tes
t pressings from
>three boroughs plants before I found one in outer Jerse
y that could handle
>grooves narrowed by the twenty-five minutes per side
 running time. It was
>only as I was preparing this post that I discovere
d The Blow Up omits Poor
>Circulation, Arrow's rarest gem.
>arrow (bootleg)
>double exposure f-85 (1980)
>01 Fire Engine
>02 Poor Circulation 5.31
>03 Little Johnny Jewel 14.44
>04 Kno
ckin' On Heaven's Door 8.07
>05 Prove It 5.20
>06 Friction 4.58
>07 (
I Can't Get No) Satisfaction 7.11
>Mitali du Mond
e said...
>Being that "mail order" dealer
>referred to here, I can veri
fy that the author (who was always an extremely
>tasteful gentleman,and t
hough we're out of touch,one of the persons in my
>life I will always hav
e a warm spot for) took exceptional effort to asure a
>quality release. W
e were proud when Tom Verlaine wanted to "legitimize" the
>recording, and
 it was mainly done for the love of the music. The "master"
>was sold for
 a very nominal fee to ROIR, and indeed,several royalty payments
>were ma
de directly to the artist.(I embarassingly refused a 20% "tip" Tom
ed me, and some of my mail order customers got a unique bonus when
ine defaced the covers of the Italian "Eno demos" LPs I had by writing
egends such as "the info about these recordings is pure bull.." on each and

>every cover!) And I still listen to a Bavon Marie Marie LP I also got w
>purchasing one of Tom's collections!!
>found here:

>"The Wonder - Tom Verlaine, Television & Stuff"
>To po
st: Mail tv@obbard.com
>To unsubscribe: Mail majordomo@obbard.com with me
ssage "unsubscribe tv"
>This email is free from viruses an
d malware because avast! Antivirus 
>protection is active.
>To post: Mail tv@obbard.com
>To unsubs
cribe: Mail majordomo@obbard.com with message "unsubscribe tv" 
>To post: Mail tv@obbard.com
>To unsubscribe: Mail majordomo
@obbard.com with message "unsubscribe tv"

To po
st: Mail tv@obbard.com
To unsubscribe: Mail majordomo@obbard.com with mes sage "unsubscribe tv"
To post: Mail tv@obbard.com
To unsubscribe: Mail majordomo@obbard.com with message "unsubscribe tv"

To post: Mail tv@obbard.com
To unsubscribe: Mail majordomo@obbard.com with message "unsubscribe tv"

This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus protection is active.

To post: Mail tv@obbard.com
To unsubscribe: Mail majordomo@obbard.com with message "unsubscribe tv"