Some Intial Comments / SRE: (TV) 33 1/3 book launch events and readings

["Leo Casey" <LeoCasey@comcast.net>]

I haven't finished (I've been reading a lot of the chapters in reverse order), 
but I have a couple of initial comments ....maybe some more substantial ones after Philip
gives his (and other readers of the book although don't think there are actually many of us 
who bothered to buy this book  maybe only 5 or 6 of us?).

If below I quote too many lines in Waterman's book without permission, he can either sue or
consider 
that my quotes might indirectly generate additional interest that results in more sales :> )

In addition to a number of typos which Robin mentioned, I found a couple of possibly egregious
but not deadly errors.

On p. 180 during his analysis of the title song, 'Marquee Moon', Waterman writes about 
a 'doubles' or 'doubling' motif that appears throughout the song, and at one point adds:  
"{It could also derive from Verlaine's experience as an identical twin.)"

>From my sources, including Ms Secret X, Tom Verlaine and his brother John were fraternal, 
not identical twins  ... but I quibble

Also, in Waterman's analysis of 'Venus' on p. 169, he writes, ""One of the oldest songs in
Television's 
repertoire, 'Venus' existed in an acoustic version dating all the way back to Verlaine's
ventures 
into Greenwich Village folk clubs, **pre-Neon boys, pre-Reno Sweeney** ."  [emphasis added].

Unlike many of Waterman's other facts or claims, no source is provided for this statement.
>From all my readings 
over the years, I have never come across this claim for 'Venus' before.  It seems to fly in the
face of common sense 
and Clinton Heylin's "From The Velvet's To The Voidoids". But who knows?  .

I thought Waterman's writing was very high quality stuff. A couple of examples:  

"The title track brings the sublime moment all [of] Side A has worked towards. .... 'Marquee
Moon helps to clarify that 
the antagonistic pairs running through all of side A's songs are figures of doubling.. Is there
a coherent self behind these 
songs?  Can we exist without reflection?  If the other songs to this point have all featured
traveling companions, on this 
one the singer journeys solo.  'Marquee Moon' is structured on a backward glance, 'I remember,'
it opens as the rhythm 
section carries us forward on a mechanical current.  The voice is a survivor's, someone who
remains to tell the tale, 
like Job or Melville's Ishmael.  Combined with the gothic setting, the glance back prepares us
for the 
devil-at-the--crossroads story to follow."  [Albeit it's possible Waterman borrowed the Robert
Johnson idea from a 
concise analysis of the song that a MM List Member once brilliantly made   (or maybe just great
minds think alike?) 
Can't remember which member.  but you know who you are ... take a bow.]

Or this: " 'Broadway looks so medieval':  Tim Mitchell  suggests Grace Church at Broadway
between 10th and 11th 
Streets as the setting invoked in this line, the clearest signal that the album's world is our
own. But I've never biked 
down Broadway at night, the Woolworth Building's lighted gothic spire looming at the
bottom-most tip of Manhattan, 
without thinking of this lyric. The song's geography has a downward sweep that responds with
the repeated ideas of 
fall/falling: in the the third verse the friends wander down Broadway, which after dark,
especially amid the 
nineteenth-century factories and warehouses of SoHo's Cast-iron District , seemed positively
abandoned.  In the 
distance, towers hulked: the new World Trade Center looming. The Woolworth, once the epitome of
modernity, 
seems dwarfed, hunchbacked and ancient."

Whew!  IMHO, that's damn good writing.  
But maybe I'm simply finding too much kinship with Waterman's  " ... I've never biked down ....
without thinking 
of this lyric", as I too have 'locations' and 'experiences/sensations' [and I know those in the
Richard Llyod camp 
are gonna gag here] that when they occur are always accompanied by one of Verlaine's unusually
fitting lyrics ....  
to a degree like no other lyricist with the possible exception of Dylan

My criticism of his long interpretation of 'Venus' [I'm not typing it here!], is that Waterman
pays shortshrift to 
'Venus' as a beautiful song about what it's like to *fall* in love.  Yeah sure, it's also got
the 'dress up like cops' angle, 
but that doesn't cancel out its heightened senses of 'falling'.   
 
Leo
> -----Original Message-----
> From: tv-owner@obbard.com [mailto:tv-owner@obbard.com] On 
> Behalf Of Robin Dunn
> Sent: Wednesday, June 22, 2011 9:55 AM
> To: tv@obbard.com
> Cc: Marquee Moon Mailing List
> Subject: Re: (TV) 33 1/3 book launch events and readings
> 
> I also just finished, and really enjoyed the book (and a lot 
> was new to me).  I'm interested in reading any discussion of 
> it here.  I'd start by saying the part that most stuck with 
> me was the idea of avoiding "known reference points" in 
> making the album.  Some of you, who may be more familiar with 
> Tom's interviews over the year, may have already known about 
> this.  But it was a new way of looking at MM for me -- it 
> explains a lot, and, I think, speaks to why the album seems 
> pretty timeless and still so fresh.
> 
> Anyway, I thought the book was very well written, and very 
> interesting (even though you would think I had had enough of 
> TV after so many years on this list).    
> 
> After MM, I immediately started the 33 1/3 "Some Girls".  May 
> seem unrelated, but actually is related in that it addresses 
> the same era in NYC.  And, it is written by a colleage of 
> Waterman's -- apparently they made the effort to address 
> these two NY albums together.  Television gets referenced by 
> page 3, with an extended quote from Lloyd.
> 
> One complaint -- where was the copy editor?  Both books have 
> a number of typos (missing words in MM, wrong dates in SG) 
> that could have been qickly caught and corrected.  To me, 
> this really detracts from the imprint.  I haven't noticed 
> this problem with 33 1/3 before now.  
> 
> Robin
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